Unit Ideas: Tiers

I'm thinking up races that we should use. Here's some ideas I have currently:


Footie
Footman - Super Footman - Captain - Demon Footman - Machina Footman

Mammalon
Gnoll - Timber Wolf - Polar Furbolg - Wildkin - Master of the Beasts

Seatra
Murloc - Murloc Ripper - Supreme Lobstrokk - Naga Myrmidon - Queen of the Tides

Flaret
Lava Spawn - Burning Rocks - Heat Runner - Devil's Warrior - Lord of the Flames


And that's all I've got so far. Here's how I'm planning on doing tiers:

Game opens: You pick a hero, then a race (Footie, Mammalon, Seatra, or Flaret). There's 5 tiers, and the 5th tier just periodically adds a leader to the 4th tier spawns. Every race has their own goods and bads (they will be discussed later.)

What do you think? (Amadi's ideas will be put up her as well when he posts them)

The ideas add more favor to the map.

How about a Golem-Based Race?

Good idea. I'll think up a set and post it.

Tech Trees: * donates tier number.
Generic Main Building
*Human (Footmen)
**Human Ranger Tier 1 (Riflemen)
***Human Ranger Tier 2 (Sorcerers)
**Human Melee Tier 1 (Knights)
***Human Melee Tier 2 (Steam Tanks..?)
*Orc (Grunts)
**Orc Ranger Tier 1 (Troll Headhunters)
***Orc Ranger Tier 2 (Shamans)
**Orc Melee Tier 1 (Raiders)
***Orc Melee Tier 2 (Taurens)
*Undead (Skeletons)
**Undead Ranger Tier 1 (Skeleton Archers)
***Undead Ranger Tier 2 (Crypt Fiends)
**Undead Melee Tier 1 (Ghouls)
***Undead Melee Tier 2 (Abominations)
*Night Elf (Archers)
**Night Elf Ranger Tier 1 (Dryads)
***Night Elf Ranger Tier 2 (Druids of the Talon)
**Night Elf Melee Tier 1 (Huntresses)
***Night Elf Melee Tier 2 (Druids of the Claw)

Was my idea, originally. Not exactly with these things, but i think that the tiers should split, therefore not all footies for example would be the same. This would add more variation, and in turn, more possible game plans. Also creates more unique combinations within teams.

So your basically saying, the game is supposed to get more unique as the game progresses?

Yes, and it will also reward people for trying out different builds, instead of finding a good combination of "Tough Melee / Offensive Ranged / Support" like people usually do in 5.4 -ar. (Night Elf + Orc + Human/Undead is widely used.) Instead of that people would have to plan their advancement, because if someone started with, say, night elf tier but advanced towards druids of the claw, he would see changes from Offensive Ranged => Support Ranged => Tough Melee. For maximum effectiveness, the teammates would have to keep this in mind.

I think I've got an idea:

We combine my idea of 100% new races with Amadi's idea of "split tiers". So, in theory, every race has 10 units. You just follow the path. So for tiers 1, 3, and 5, you could have ranged and tiers 2 and 4 you could have melee. Or any combination.

I think that would be a good way to work it. And I'd personally not want to use Orc/Human/Undead/Night elf, since its so re-hashed and overused. I won't mind using units from those races, but I would prefer not to have entire tiers based off of them.

That would work fine, i used O/H/U/N as an example for the most part, due to not having time to come up with the races.

I like the others, i'm not sure if i like Mammalon that much though, mammals are well.. A really broad category, and i think we could define it a bit narrower.

*Forestlol: (Gnoll Fighters.)
**Forestlol Ranged Tier 1: (Forest-Troll Berserkers.)
***Forestlol Ranged Tier 2: (Forest-Troll Trappers.)
**Forestlol Melee Tier 1: (Furbolgs.)
***Forestlol Melee Tier 2: (Furbolg Ursa Warriors.)

Or something to that degree, i feel like the 'leader' units would work really good as something that you buy for reinforcements from the 'unit-shop' that i'd like to have to be race-specific. (Once you have tier N, you can train say, shocklizards/Troll Warlords etc.)

How would that sound?

Okay, we can broaden it. I like that idea. I don't like the name though (it's forest + lol), but it can be changed. I think we should have maybe 6 races. Regarding the items, not every shop will have all their own items. I think each racial shop should get only a couple unique items (like in melee games).

Yes, but then again, it wouldn't be very hard to have one race have potions of healing (Say, footmans?) whereas something else (Forest race?) would have potions of Rejuvenation. That would be pretty simple, and if watched for balance would add lot more unique feel to each race. Some items should be common to all races of course.

That's what I meant. Say, the gnolls have special regeneration items that are stronger than the other races', but lack weaponry. Or something. You get the idea.

Dark how do you come up with the names do you have a 4 year old on crack at your house?

I like games where all the choices are in a "Pro & Con" Fashion.

More i've thought of it, more i've come into conclusion that we need a
techy-race. Goblins/Dwarves with stupid explosives. They are overdone,
but they are also really popular and work well in action. They also
have plenty of models to go with. (Shredders, Zeppelins, Alchemists,
Mortars, Tanks, Riflemen.. I'm not even starting on custom models,
because i want to keep the map size low initially, and if i start of
thinking of them i can't stop.)



In addition, forest-themed race would be awesome. This is already covered in Mammalia. (Or whatever the name will be.)



What do you say about demon-tier? I don't mean it as in
"Burning-Legion." but as in "Outland has a lot of themed models, such
as draenei and stuff.". I think they could fill the 'evil' theme of the
game rather well. (Every game needs something that is evil from flavour point of view, because people want to play evil. ). Also, there are lots and lots of models for them, and it'd be rather stupid not to use them, wouldn't it. Also, (Flaret might work brilliantly as a path in here, or read the end of the post.)



As you suggested, a water-based race. Water elementals, nagas etc. This seems cool and should work well enough.

'Holy' race. This comes in as pretty much mandatory - Footmen, Elven
Footmen, Knights, Archers and so on. People also want to play good. (Again: every game needs something that is good from flavour point of view, because people want to play good. ).

We're in five now, assuming you agree with these. If we don't choose to use Flaret as a path in demons, we could also take water elementals from Aquaria (Leaving them nagas and murlocs, turtles, snap drakes.. plenty enough.) and make a "Elemental Race" with Earth Elementals (Golem model, right?), Fire Elementals, Water Elementals and if someone figures out a way to create an air elemental, air elementals.

These are my opinions, and i'd like to hear your opinions on my opinions to have more opinions based on opinions about opinions.

For that elemental golem thingy, there SHOULD be some custom elemental-based golem models I remember seeing something like that. I don't remember if it's from the Hive, or wc3campaigns.

MEcha golem Really retarted looking robotic golem. :p i know its not a elemental but whatever

Amadi, I agree with pretty much everything you said. I'll update the tiers in the first post later tonight.

Mooo-Gunsniper wrote:For that elemental golem thingy, there SHOULD be some custom elemental-based golem models I remember seeing something like that. I don't remember if it's from the Hive, or wc3campaigns.

I'd rather use Mountain Giant with normal skin, trust me.

Not only because it spends less space, but also because it suits our needs better and.. Looks better.

And we can color-tint it and add graphisc via abilities to make it elemental.

So I'm guessing the infernal, mountain giant, mud/rock/granite golem, and war/siege golem will obviously be used?

Mooo-Gunsniper wrote:So I'm guessing the infernal, mountain giant, mud/rock/granite golem, and war/siege golem will obviously be used?

Not necessarily. Infernal will be (I'd figure it out as a support unit.. One from unit shop.). MG will also probably be used. Granite Golems seem like they'd have their uses as well. Siege golem i'm not sure of, it might be a support unit for "Holy" race.

So will there be custom skins cause i know maps with lighting wind and fire custom golem skins.